Mr. PUGSLEY.

I do not think my hon. friend has had much experience in employing labour, by the way he talks. Now, whereas a few years ago you could get labouring men at $1, to-day you cannot get them for that. If I remember correctly the figures which my hon. friend from St. Antoine (Mr. Ames) read, there was a considerable larger proportion of men employed at $1.40 and $1.00 last year than there were in 1905. Three or four years ago you could get a gang of men at from $1 to $1.25, and to-day you cannot get those men at less than $1.40 to $1.50 a day. It is a fact that wages have increased in the last three or four years.

Mr. SAM. HUGHES.

There is a lumberman sitting right behind the minister, and if the minister asks him he will tell the 'minister that he started in last year by paying $56 a month to his men in the camp, and he can get them this year for $25, all he wants.

Mr. PUGSLEY.

That may be so for the moment; we know that the wages of lumbermen are less than they were last year, because there is not as great a demand for labour. But we are speaking of work which was done last year. My hon. friend referred to the fact that in the original estimate the cost of this work was placed at a very much higher figure than it is now being constructed for. I may say that the original view of the engineering department was that a breakwater built simply of brush and stone would not be likely to

stand, and it was proposed to protect that work with a slope of quarried stone, which alone would cost $150,000.

Mr. LALOR.

The hon. member for Inverness (Mr. McLennan) is surprised at the furore, as he calls it, on this side of the House in connection with this subject. There is no objection on this side of the House to this work being done, the objection is as to the manner in which it is being done and the expenditure. Any one who Is acquainted with the price and purchase of stone, either for his own use or for public works, cannot but realize that the price of stone must vary a great deal at this particular place from the price elsewhere. The parties who sold this stone must have been receiving an extravagant price for it. I notice in one case $2.75 a yard, not a cord, was paid for stone, in another case $2.50, in another case $2.25. Another price was $2 per yard. Then some unfortunate man could only get $1 a yard, and even down to 50 cents, and as low as 20 cents a yard was paid. 20 cents, I imagine, would be very cheap indeed for stone. But when you come to pay a price ranging from $2 to $2.75 per yard, it must strike any one acquainted with the price of stone as most extravagant. I do not know whether this is cut stone. If it is all rough stone, I cannot understand such a price. If this is a sample of the general expenditure in connection with this work, it is time the minister should look into it.

Mr. PUGSLEY.

Would my hon. friend tell me what would be a fair price for large stone, say one to two cubic yards?

Mr. LALOR.

$4 to $5 per cord would be a large price for stone.

Mr. PUGSLEY.

I am speaking of large stone, stone containing one to two cubic yards. Would my hon. friend say that $2.75 is too much for such stone, delivered at this breakwater?

Mr. LALOR.

Yes. In all my experience I never heard of such a price as $2.75.

Mr. MCLENNAN.

The quarry is quite a distance from the works. In the first place, they have to quarry the stone, and, it has to be less than a cubic yard in size, otherwise it would not be taken on the work. In the second place, the stone has to be carried away to the water's edge, and thence it has to be scowed out to the end of the breakwater, about 2,000 or 2,500 feet, and derricks and other appliances have to be provided to land it. That price is given for large stone delivered, and it is only a small portion of the stone that costs that amount. Field stone is paid for at the rate of from 50 to 60 cents per cubic yard.

Mr. PUGSLEY.

There is a great difference in stone. Quite a large quantity Mr. PUGSLEY.

of it was purchased for 50 cents and some as low as 15 cents a cubic yard. Where you have a large stone which is quarried out, where it is considered desirable to place it in large blocks on this work and where it has to be brought by lighters, I should say that $2.75 per cubic yard is a reasonable price. The quantity is very small. There are only 05 cubic yards at $2.75. I am informed by the chief engineer that in Prince Edward Island, where large stone has been purchased by public tender, the lowest tender was $3.75 per cubic yard. I do not think the hon. gentleman is for a moment justified in making the statement that he has.

Mr. LALOR.

Mr. PUGSLEY.

For that kind of stone these people only get 50 cents a yard.

Mr. LALOR.

It is not brown stone.

Mr. A. MARTIN (Queens, P.E.I.).

I understood the minister to say that $3.75 a yard was paid in Prince Edward Island. I would like to know what kind of stone it is and where it is being used. .

Mr. PUGSLEY.

It is being used in the Souris breakwater.

Mr. A. MARTIN (Queens, P.E.I.).

What kind is it ?

Mr. PUGSLEY.

Large quarried stone.

Mr. A. MARTIN (Queens, P.E.I.).

Freestone or red sandstone ?

Mr. PUGSLEY.

Freestone.

Mr. A. MARTIN (Queens, P.E.I.).

Does any one believe that you are building the Souris breakwater with freestone ?