August 23, 1917

LIB

Alexander Kenneth Maclean

Liberal

Mr. A. K. MACLEAN:

Except that he

might not have time to carry it out at all.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Charles Joseph Doherty (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DOHERTY:

If there is not time to carry it out at all, I suppose the Governor in Council would not try it. All he is empowered to do is to make provision for the polling of their votes in the manner by this part provided. He cannot change the manner.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
LIB

George Perry Graham

Liberal

Mr. GRAHAM:

Read the balance of the section.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Charles Joseph Doherty (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DOHERTY:

(Reading):

On a day prior to their departure, and may modify the provisions of this part relating to time or procedure in so far as may be necessary to render such polling possible.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
LIB

Alexander Kenneth Maclean

Liberal

Mr. A. K. MACLEAN:

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Charles Joseph Doherty (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DOHERTY:

I think the question for the committee is whether under those exceptional conditions it is willing to entrust the Governor in Council to provide to meet them. If it is not, of course I do not know how we can very well deal with it. I am willing to insert any words that may be useful.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
LIB

Alexander Kenneth Maclean

Liberal

Mr. A. K. MACLEAN:

I only mention it so that the attention of the minister may be drawn to it.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
LIB

Daniel Duncan McKenzie

Liberal

Mr. McKENZIE:

Will this Act apply to home guards, where there are home regiments?

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Charles Joseph Doherty (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DOHERTY:

It would apply to the militia on active service. Militia on active service may be away from their homes just the same as the Canadian Expeditionary Force.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink

Section agreed to. On section 17-Offences and penalties:


LIB

Edward Mortimer Macdonald

Liberal

Mr. MACDONALD:

Of course, this section is of no. value unless there is some amendment to the Militia Act by which the doing of these things would be a military offence. It could not be enforced outside the country. I suggest to the minister whether we could amend the Militia Act.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Charles Joseph Doherty (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DOHERTY:

It strikes me as a somewhat remarkable thing to try to make these duties military duties. While it is quite true that if the offences be committed outside of Canada we will not be able to apply the punishment-at least I take that to be the law-it is also true that those things may be brought about by people who are in Canada, although the operation itself is actually effected outside of Canada. Those parties in Canada would be subject to the punishment. Then we must remember that this statute also has application in Canada for the taking of military votes in Canada. As to the suggestion that we should make this offence a violation of military duty, it would certainly be extreme to apply it to people who are not military officers.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
LIB

Edward Mortimer Macdonald

Liberal

Mr. MACDONALD:

It would be of no value to those who were not military officers nor attached to the force. This may be only mere ornamentation and intended to apply only to stray persons in Canada, who may be connected, in some way or another, with the force; but suppose men connected with the taking of the votes in England or France found that some fraud had been

committed, there is no way in which any penalty could be imposed on them, unless the minister would amend the Militia Act 'so that anything made an offence under this measure could be dealt with by the military authorities. The trouble about the whole thing is that military offenders can not be punished unless the Imperial authorities pass some complementary legislation.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Charles Joseph Doherty (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DOHERTY:

The whole proceeding is distinctly a civilian affair, and it seems to be rather unfair to seek by our law to make a man who happens to be a military officer amenable for an offence for which a civilian doing the same thing would not be amenable. If the hon. gentleman will look over the section he will find that many more of those things can be done in Canada than he conceives. People in Canada,

- for instance, may seek to prevent the delivering of those messages. This provision is far from being mere ornamentation.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
LIB

Edward Mortimer Macdonald

Liberal

Mr. MACDONALD:

It simply means this, that anything in the way of infraction of the law that can be committed may be committed in England and France, and nothing will be done to the party who commits the offence. Will the minister see if he can find some way of carrying out my suggestion?

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Charles Joseph Doherty (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. DOHERTY:

I shall be glad to think about that as well as about other matters. At first glance it strikes me as an extraordinary proposition that we should make offences of this kind military offences.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Robert Laird Borden (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Sir ROBERT BORDEN:

So far as I am able to understand the suggestion of my hon. friend, I do not think it would advance the matter one whit further.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
LIB

Edward Mortimer Macdonald

Liberal

Mr. MACDONALD:

I make the suggestion only as a possible solution. There is no sense in inserting in this Military Voters' Act a quantity of fanciful infractions of the -law, and penalties, and things of that kind if they are to .be only of as much value as waste paper. Can not something better be devised?

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
CON

Robert Laird Borden (Prime Minister; Secretary of State for External Affairs; President of the Privy Council)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Sir ROBERT BORDEN:

My hon. friend is mistaken. This section has an application in Canada and therefore, it is not purely ornamentation. Outside of Canada, it has at least a certain moral effect; it is there on the statute book. If we should attempt to convert offences of this kind into military offences, we would simply be attempting to evade 'the plain provisions of the Militia Act and the corresponding Act

[Mr Macdonald.]

in the United Kingdom to which, in the final analysis, we have to resort for the enforcement of military law.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink
LIB

George Perry Graham

Liberal

Mr. GRAHAM:

You might make ad

these men honourary colonels and bring them under the Militia Act.

Topic:   THE MILITARY VOTERS' ACT, 1917.
Subtopic:   FURTHER CONSIDERATION IN COMMITTEE.
Permalink

August 23, 1917