February 13, 1928

LIB
?

Some hon. MEMBERS:

Carried.

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LIB

Hewitt Bostock (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

I declare the main motion, as amended, carried.

Motion (Mr- Woodsworth) as aimended agreed to.

NATIONAL RESEARCH INSTITUTE Mr. E. J. GARLAND (Bow River) moved:

That in the opinion of this house, the time is now come when the further development ot our country requires the establishment ot a national research institute, and that this should be undertaken by the Dominion government.

He said: Mr. Speaker, my chief excuse, if

excuse be needed, for addressing the house on this subject to-night is the apathy of the public on the need for a national research institute. The whole trend of my discourse I hope will be in the direction of sympathetic cooperation with what I understand the go\ -eminent has in mind. At the outset let me congratulate the Minister of Trade and Commerce (Mr. Malcolm) on the statement- which I understand is correct-that there is to be included this year a large item in the estimates for the establishment of such an institute. I am not sure that I altogether agree that the amount proposed to be provided will be enough, but it is going to be a very healthy start in the right direction. It took the war to shatter the complacency not only of Canada but of England in regard to the matter of research. Prior to that time both countries had drifted along without worrying very much about what research meant, what it might do for the country, or anything else. Many of us had grasped theoretically the idea that Germany's great industrial progress was the result of the application of research to industry. It was not, however, I say, until the war itself that England and subsequently Canada realized the value of research in the development of their own resources and in the organization of their own industries. ^

We established a national research council and to that council belongs a great deal of credit for having maintained public interest during the years that have elapsed. It is true they have had a tremendous task. Public interest started waning in 1918 and it continued waning until a series of articles appearing in the press in 1927 again brought this question before the public. The amount that

412 . COMMONS

National Research-Mr. Garland (Bow River)

is to be expended on this kind of an institute must from the very outset be adequate. At the present time research work is to a limited extent being carried on within our departments of government; our universities are trying to do something along that line, and a few of our larger manufacturing concerns maintain laboratories. But the government services are necessarily largely curtailed and localised;1 the work of the universities is almost entirely local, and the work of both the government and universities prior to this time has been diffused because of the necessity of carrying on partly educational work as well as research work at the same time. There is in Canada practically not one gentleman who is carrying on research work who is devoting his entire time to it. The other day I picked up an article that was printed in the Canadian Forum and I find that view supported by this statement,

Scientists in the direct employ of industry In this country are still occupied more largely with regulatory duties than with research. In fine, it is true that with pitifully few exceptions, there are no scientists in Canada whose whole business is research. Almost all are able to devote to research only what dregs of time and energy are left over from other important and often multifarious duties.

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CON

Peter McGibbon

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. McGIBBON:

Does the hon. gentleman mean that in the broadest sense or in regard only to industrial research?

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UFA

Edward Joseph Garland

United Farmers of Alberta

Mr. GARLAND (Bow River):

I am

dealing with research in its broadest sense.

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CON
UFA
CON

Peter McGibbon

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. PETER McGIBBON (Muskoka-Ontario):

It was not my intention, Mr. Speaker, to take part in this debate until a few moments ago, and I rise now principally for two reasons. First, I want to contradiot a statement made by the previous speaker (Mr. Garland) that there is not a single man in Canada engaged in pure science. Second, I want to congratulate the government, especially the Minister of Trade and Commerce (Mr. Malcolm) and the Minister of the Interior (Mr. Stewart), for the support they have given to this cause for a good many years. It is now nearly ten years since I first raised my voice in this parliament on behalf of scientific and industrial research, and as the years have gone by I have been more and and more impressed not only by the desirability but by the absolute necessity of Canada's indulging in some such form of assistance as is now proposed.

My criticism of the government on this particular occasion is two-fold. First, they are six or seven years too late; and secondly, the support which they are giving to scientific and industrial research is far too meagre. I

National Research-Mr. McGibbon

believe the Minister of Trade and Commerce is going to ask parliament to vote something like three-quarters of a million dollars for this purpose. If he had doubled, trebled, or quadrupled that amount, it would be more in keeping with the necessities of the case. The time has long since come when this country and every other country must use to the fullest possible extent all the advantages of science in order to keep pace with the other countries of the world. And in that connection, Mr. Speaker, I should not want it to go out to the world in the language of the hon. member for Bow River (Mr. Garland) that the great country of Canada has not been able to produce a scientist; that the universities of this country have not made it possible for a single man in Canada to devote his or her whole time to science. I think, Sir, he must be sadly ignorant of the history of his own country, sadly ignorant of the history of his own province I recall to his mind certain names which have recently been placed on the honour roll of accomplishment in scientific research-such men as Professor Collip, of Alberta university, one of the principal assistants to Doctor Banting in perfecting the insulin discovery; Professor McCallum, of McGill university; Doctor Banting himself, of Toronto university and Professor Macleod, all of whom are devoting all their time and energy to scientific research. I should like to remind my hon. friend that Professor McCallum has made discoveries which have been recognized the world over. He has been offered the presidency of five universities and he is now devoting all his time to fundamental science at McGill.

Indeed, I do not have to go further than the city of Ottawa. May I direct attention to the discoveries of Doctor Watson and the work he is doing? Need I recall the fact that this government is completing a $70,000 building across the river, and also the remarkable result which Doctor Watson recently achieved in reducing an expenditure of $47,000 in connection with dourine compensation, first to $300 and later to $70? Might I call attention to the work done in the Department of Agriculture in developing the different grades of grain, a work which has meant millions of dollars of value to this country? I do this only to show that Canadians have not been behind in this field; that we have within our own borders men of intelligence, industry and ability in scientific and industrial research.

I should like to ask my hon. friend too, Sir, if he heard anything about the work of Canadians during the war. Are the scientists IMr. McGibbon.]

of Canada behind those of other countries? I should like to remind him of the great task placed on the shoulders of one Canadian during the war, a task equal if not superior to that performed by any other man during that period: I refer to the closing of the strait

of Dover against submarines, a task which was given to a Canadian. Gathering about him a staff of Canadians, he and his assistants worked some twelve or fifteen months; the strait of Dover was closed in August, 1917, and not a submarine went through after that. What had been applied there could also be applied in the North sea, we are told, except for one portion which was too deep, and that could be looked after by other means.

I could refer also to the work of a Canadian in connection with the submarine telephone, a thing of inestimable value. I could recall the work in Toronto of Doctor Banting, who within the last few years discovered the secret of the treatment of diabetes. That was something scientists all over the world had been looking for, and it fell to the lot of a Canadian to make the discovery, one of inestimable value to mankind not only in the relief of suffering but in the prolonging of human life; and every year a man's life is prolonged through the application of that remedy means a natural source of revenue to the country.

I might go on, if time would permit, and point out to my hon. friend, to the house and to the country what the different pathologists, the great seekers of the unknown in all the universities of Canada, have been doing in the past, and to show to him that much as we admire immigrants, who come to our shores, we are not prepared to admit that the native born subject is inferior to any man on eatth.

I should like to congratulate the government upon the steps which they are taking in this matter. For ten year3 I have preached this doctrine in the house. I believe that for every dollar they expend they will receive ten-fold in return. I could give the house illustrations which I have put on Hansard in the past of the great returns which have been made on the money invested in scientific and industrial research. I could tell you, for example, of a discovery made by a firm in the American republic to the south where, by improving the grade of yeast, that single firm has saved $500,000 a year. I could refer you to the great Pasteur, and not only in the realm of medicine and surgery; I could tell you about his scientific work in France in connection with the silk worm, splenic fern and with wines

National Research-Mr. Malcolm

and other discoveries. The eminent Huxley stated that his three discoveries created enough wealth for the French republic to pay off the debt, for the Franco-Prussian war.

I could take you to the great industries of Canada and show you their magnitude. We have a fishing industry bringing in about $40,000,000 a year, and we are told by scientists that the waste of oil from the by-products is twenty-five per cent of the total value of the fish. I could point to the waste products of the saw mills and pulp mills and show you the possibilities of creating wealth from material that is now thrown away. I sat on a committee which gathered evidence some years ago, and we were told by scientists that an ordinary load of sawdust would produce ten gallons of ethyl alcohol, while one bushel of grain would only produce about three. Here is an opportunity for utilization of an absolute waste of the industries of this country to-day, material which is largely thrown into our streams and swamps. I could tell you of vast industries that were created during the war. For instance, Mr. Speaker, you will remember that early in the struggle our scientists told us that if Great Britain would only shut off the imports of cotton into Germany the war would be over in six months. When public opinion was brought to the point, and the blockade was put in force, what was the result? Germany put her scientists to work and from cellulose they developed a product to take the place of cotton-and the war went on. I could tell you that when Germany's imports of potash salts were restricted -and, of course, as everyone knows, these form the basis of fertilizers and other important things-the scientists of that country by an electrical process extracted nitrogen from the air and rendered Germany independent of the imported salts. I could tell you about the great artificial silk industry of this country which has been developed, how under pressure and through chemical processes cellulose is converted into artificial silk. Thus I might go on with one industry after another of the Dominion and Show how their development has been due to the application of science, and point out the possibilities of the future in this direction. This, sir, is the duty before the government. The waste in our forests today is awful to contemplate. In the heart of the country I come from you will see hemlock bark, which in past years was used for the tanning of leather, now allowed to rot, the cost of transporting it to the markets being prohibitive. Some years ago I pointed out to the research council the possibility of extracting the tanning material from the bark 56103-27*

by commercial processes. So far it has not been successfully done- But you can take countries like Germany, the United States and Great Britain and note how the application of science! to industrial research has brought about remarkable developments in various industries.

Again, Mr. Speaker, I congratulate the government, because it is one of the few times that I can agree with its policy. Particularly do I congratulate my friend the Minister of Trade and Commerce that at last he has had the courage to imake a start on this path. I very heartily support him and the government in this policy. My only criticism tonight is that instead of asking for $750,000 they should bring down a requisition for at least $3,000,000. They will need the money in the next two or three years, and they know it. Then why not make a start, and make it with courage, and so give our industries the advantage of the latest scientific research? Let us put them on an equal footing with the industries of other countries. In a word, let us develop Canada for Canadians.

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LIB

James Malcolm (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Liberal

Hon. JAMES MALCOLM (Minister of Trade and Commerce):

Mr. Speaker, I do not wish to delay the house at any length tonight, but there are one or two observations that I should like to make now that this resolution presents the opportunity. Naturally it is very gratifying for a member of the government to have the support which has been given me by my hon. friend from Bow River (Mr. Garland) and my hon. friend from Muskoka (Mr. McGibbon). Indeed, I doubt if any other subject has met, or will meet, with as general approval from the house as the subject of the development of scientific and industrial research.

For many years outstanding men in this house have ' advocated increased expenditure on industrial research. Mr. Hume Cronyn raised his voice in this chamber on many occasions in season and out of season in his efforts to impress upon us the necessity of greater expenditure in this regard, and I believe the time has come when the public conscience has been awakened to an extent that will justify a forward movement in this field of endeavour.

May I compliment my friends from Bow River and Muskoka for having covered a great deal of the subject, which relieves me of the necessity of reviewing it to-night. I wish consequently to point out just two things. First, I appreciate the sincere criticism of my friend from Muskoka that we are not asking for a large enough vote. Let

National Research-Mr. Malcolm

me tell him that the $750,000 is being asked at the request of the national scientific and industrial research council. After going ovqr the whole matter with that body it was estimated that it would take about three million dollars during a period of five or ten years to construct the laboratories necessary at the capital to carry on this work. It was further felt however that in this year's program it was not possible to spend a greater sum for the first unit of the buildings than appears in the estimates. The council also asked for an increase from $170,000 to $300,000 for administrative purposes for the current year. That increase appears in our estimates. Thus in doing what we propose we are acting on the advice of the only body in Canada which is in a position to advise us. It is true we might have asked the house to vote a larger sum of money, but it could not be advantageously expended this year. The house must remember this fact, that the building up of the executive of the research council is a comparatively easy matter; we have many able public men in the Dominion who will be glad to join the board of the research council and give it the benefit of their advice. The building up of a trained staff to operate the laboratories, however, is a matter which will require time and very careful selection. At the moment there is not an unlimited number of men available with the necessary scientific knowledge to go into the pure science of the many subjects which we will undoubtedly have to take up, and tthe development of the laboratories will therefore of necessity be progressive. I hope in this connection that from year to year we shall be coming to parliament asking for ever-increasing sums of money as the work develops. I wish, too, to point out that there is a very considerable amount of scientific work being done by the various departments of government, and that this work will have gradually to be amalgamated with the work of the main laboratories. That amalgamation will take time, and the scientific men in the various government departments will gradually find themselves, as opportunities occur, working under one head. That is what we shall try to accomplish.

Now, as to any possible overlapping between federal and provincial endeavours in this field, may I say this? It is the opinion and advice of the national research council that Canada has within the various provinces many research problems which are entirely local. The council feels that from its vote it may be able to assist in research work on such local problems by contributions to a

[Mr Malcolm.]

university situated within the province. In that way provincial governments themselves, if they choose to vote further sums of money, will have such local research work under their own observation, so to speak. Without going into a discussion of the coal problem, wa know that we have very great fields of coal. We know that our Alberta coal is high in moisture content, and we know that one of the difficulties in coking our Nova Scotia coal is that it is high in sulphur content. Each of these problems is distinctly different. One can be studied at Dalhousie university, the other at the university of Alberta in Edmonton. The research council is quite conversant with the fact that such problems will probably have to be allocated to the different universities throughout the country.

May I now say a word, Mr. Speaker, with regard to the remarks of my friend from Bow River (Mr. Garland)? The hon. member stated and, I think, incorrectly, as the hon. member for Muskoka-Ontario (Mr. Mc-Gibbon) mentioned, that there has not been a great deal of research work done in Canada, I would point out to my hon. friend that private industry in Canada in many cases has done some very valuable research work. The work that is being done at McGill university with the support of the pulp and paper industry has put the pulp and paper industry in Canada to the very forefront of that industry throughout the world. That has been done without direct government assistance, though it is true that the Minister of the Interior (Mr. Stewart) has made some contributions toward a building or the maintenance of a building and has cooperated in the work in every possible way.

Let me mention another instance. The Department of Mines of the Dominion of Canada has done some work that is rather interesting, and if I can find a letter which I have on my desk and which came unsolicited a few days ago, it will reveal to the house some of the very valuable work which has been done. A high grade magnesite ore exists in Austria, and prior to the war magnesite was imported from that country as a refractory for open hearth steel furnaces. During the war a magnesite industry was developed in Canada from a low grade ore, but after the war the lower grade ore was unable to compete with the Austrian magnesite which again came on the market. Those interested in the development of this work here appealed to the research council; a great deal of study was given to the subject, and as a result of that research we have now reached the point where these men say that the

National Research-Mr. Malcolm

Canadian market is being almost completely supplied with Canadian magnesite and a growing export market is being developed in Great Britain and the United States. Thus one of our natural resources is being developed and a large part of the result of that growth flows along export lines. That this has been made possible is due largely to assistance received from the national research council.

I do not want to weary the house by reciting all the work that has been done in connection with agricultural research but it has been considerable. Neither do I want to review all the work that has been done in mining research, but I can assure the house it also has been considerable. I might refer to the benefit we have received from research work done in the United States. Indeed, we have been very fortunate in being able to get the benefits of research carried on by other countries, though I do not know that we should be particularly proud of our being in such a position.

In this regard I desire to make a remark with which all members on this side of the house may not agree. The development of our natural resources is very important; taking a raw product and putting it into a more highly finished state is always essential to the wealth of a nation. Any man realizes that pig iron does not bring as high a price as watch springs. But there is another feature about research: when a need arises and there is a potential market in a nation for a certain product, that product will be manufactured within the nation even though the raw material has to come from the four corners of the globe. Let me illustrate this. Some men say that industry should be indigenous to a country. Very well. Can anyone tell me why it is that Canada imports raw rubber from another part of the empire on the opposite side of the world; imports long fibre cotton from Egypt, brings a heavy commodity half-way around the world to this continent, brings it indeed to the centre of the continent, fabricates it there and then ships rubber tires and rubber shoes to the value of many millions a year back to the country of origin of the raw material? How did that come about? Not only do we do that, but we produce these commodities here at a price comparable with that in any other country in the world. This is more than taking coals to Newcastle. It is bringing coals from Newcastle and shipping them back after they have been re-processed by intelligent labour and science. That is what it means. Research has built up the rubber industry

from the milk which was found in the rubber trees to the tires and all the other multitudinous products which are made of rubber. Rubber has revolutionized our methods of transportation. Rubber has contributed to the progress of the world probably as much as any other raw commodity to which science has been applied. But science, while it has built up the rubber industry in Canada to the extent of production per annum to the value of $100,000,000, has done so by working on a product which Canadian industry has brought from the four corners of the earth for the service of the Canadian people.

In appealing, therefore, for a vote for industrial and scientific research, I appeal not only on the ground of the development of our own raw material which we inevitably have to export to some extent in some form, but also on the ground that if we have to export some of our nickel ore, for instance, to a country that wants to make its own nickel products, we should also develop our own nickel for our own needs to the greatest possible extent in Canada. But on the same basis we need to apply science to those raw materials of other countries which we desire to import in order to develop within this country the production of articles which we require for consumption here. I know I do not need to appeal further on this matter.

I am most heartily in accord with the resolution of the hon. member for Bow River, as I feel every member of this house . is, and I only hope that the thought thrown out by that hon. member with regard to the support of industry will be heeded by those engaged in industry. The Dominion government owes it to the people to supply the scientific knowledge, the laboratories, the equipment. Industry itself directly benefits, but the consumer benefits also and so does the country as a whole. The past shows that industry itself in the United States has been particularly generous to science and I feel that Canadian industry will respond in the same way.

If the benefits of scientific research in other countries were obtainable in Canada free; if we could get all the scientific knowledge we wanted from Germany, Great Britain and the United States for nothing; if we did not need to spend a dollar to learn all we require to know with regard to science in industry, I should still be in favour of voting money for industrial research. The opportunities in this Dominion of Canada for work in pure science, for work on specific problems, are so great that if we vote the necessary money we shall create opportunities in scientific work for

National Research-Mr. Malcolm

probably 50 per cent of the graduates of our universities, and we shall be doing something which we can well afford to do by the expenditure of federal money, namely, provide occupation at home for our scientists.

I may say for the information of the house that it is the intention of the government to erect in Ottawa on a ten^cre plot secured without cost from the Department of Agriculture, the first unit of a national research laboratory, and a central power plant as well. This will bring the first unit of the laboratory close to the experimental farm, and will give the officials at the farm the benefit of the research work done there in connection with agricultural science.

May I say further that it is the intention of the government to have the national research council work on all problems with regard to all industries, and if the people in any particular industry think the work of the council is to be devoted exclusively to that industry, they are mistaken. There is further research work to be done in agriculture, as well as in connection with our fisheries and our mines, and as the work goes on and as the house becomes better informed as to what is being done by the research council, I think it will be very interesting to listen to the debates, because I believe many valuable suggestions will come from members of the house who apparently are so whole-heartedly in support of this work.

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CON

Simon Fraser Tolmie

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. TOLMIE:

May I ask a question?

I should like to know if anything is being done by the research council in connection with the utilization of waste material left in the woods after the logs have been removed?

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LIB

James Malcolm (Minister of Trade and Commerce)

Liberal

Mr. MALCOLM:

I cannot answer my

hon. friend's question offhand. There is an order of the house for a return, which will be tabled perhaps to-morrow, dealing with the various subjects which the research council has under consideration. It covers several pages of paper, and when it is brought down perhaps my hon. friend might look at it and find the answer to his question.

M-r. McGIBBON: I should like to ask the Minister of Trade and Commerce if he would be good enough to have a conversation with his colleague the Minister of Health (Mr. King), to see if he cannot stir the dry bones of that institution so as to get something done along these same lines.

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LIB

Charles A. Stewart (Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs; Minister of Mines; Minister of the Interior)

Liberal

Hon. CHARLES STEWART (Minister of the Interior):

My remarks, on this occasion, will be very brief, because I expect to take part in the discussion on the next motion on the

order paper, which is almost identical with that now before the house. May I say, however, in answer to the hon. member for Victoria (Mr. Tolmie), that the research work in wood products which has been conducted up to the present has been carried out by the Department of the Interior, and we have not yet commenced the study of the utilization of waste timber. We have been devoting our attention mainly to the study of wood preservatives, wood testing and kindred subjects. Through the generosity of the Canadian Pulp and Paper Association, a laboratory is being constructed at McGill university which will be partly occupied by our staff, Where further scientific work will be carried on. I say it will be partly occupied by our staff, because the research work in cellulose and kindred subjects relative to the pulp and paper industry will be carried on by the professors of McGill university.

I should just like to say, Mr. Speaker, that ever since coming to Ottawa, in season and out of season, I have been a consistent advocate of a greater expenditure and a greater endeavour in scientific and industrial research. I think I realized its value from the time Doctor Saunders did so much for the wheat growers of the west when he evolved the marquis wheat; no one can estimate what that meant to our western farmers, and as I have said, from that time on my interest in scientific and industrial research has been constant. We have not been altogether idle in Canada; many interesting problems are being studied at the present time, and I will mention just one in the province of Alberta. Our own provincial university there is studying the extraction of what we think will be helium gas from the products of our own gas fields. I am not going into a discussion of what that will be worth-

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CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

Where is the market for it?

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LIB

Charles A. Stewart (Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs; Minister of Mines; Minister of the Interior)

Liberal

Mr. STEWART (Edmonton):

It is an interesting problem, to see whether or not we can extract it from our own gas.

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CON

Richard Bedford Bennett (Leader of the Official Opposition)

Conservative (1867-1942)

Mr. BENNETT:

Why not try something more practical?

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LIB

Charles A. Stewart (Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs; Minister of Mines; Minister of the Interior)

Liberal

Mr. STEWART (Edmonton):

I merely

mention that as one of the problems under consideration. The same thing can be said about mu' great tar sand deposits, which were mentioned by the hon. member for Bow River (Mr. Garland).

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CON
LIB

Charles A. Stewart (Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs; Minister of Mines; Minister of the Interior)

Liberal

Mr. STEWART (Edmonton):

In connection with iron, we have gone this far in the

National Research-Mr. Stewart (Edmonton)

laboratories of the mines branch here; the slag now thrown off from the deposits at Sudbury could be economically put through a process, and the iron ore utilized. But with regard to the other problem, that of the low grade hematite ores, we have not gone very far in our research work. I may say, however, that we are keeping very closely in touch with what is being done in that connection in every other country, and we are not without hope that something may eventually be accomplished.

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CON
LIB

Charles A. Stewart (Superintendent-General of Indian Affairs; Minister of Mines; Minister of the Interior)

Liberal

Mr. STEWART (Edmonton):

I agree that it is one of the most important questions, but I would not put it as the most important one. There is another point which I should like to discuss, leaving out the coal question, which will come up later when the motion which follows this one on the order paper is taken up. I wish to issue an invitation to all members of this house to attend a lecture which I hope to have held here, to be given by one of our own officers in the surveys branch, which will show how we have advanced in the making of aerial surveys in Canada. We have the proud distinction at the present time of leading the world in aerial surveys, and it is my intention, for the benefit of those members of this house who may be interested, to have the officer in charge of this work give a demonstration in the railway committee room of how the work is performed, how the maps are made, and the benefits of that method of surveying as opposed to the slower and more tedious method of ground work upon which we have had to depend in the past. I know one of the hon. members opposite made a very serious charge against our map making, but we are quite prepared to demonstrate what we have been able to do in aerial photography, and I can safely say that we are not lagging behind in that field at any rate. The Minister of Trade and Commerce (Mr. Malcolm) mentioned what has been done in connection with magnesite, and there are many other matters in Which the scientists of our country have made names for themselves in industrial and scientific research.

My hope is that with the establishment [DOT]of these laboratories and with the greater encouragement we will be able to hold out, we can get a larger body of young men to go in for scientific work. I think it important that it should be said now that it is the hope of the national council that the universities of Canada shall be first utilized to their fullest extent, because from the universities we shall have to recruit the men to undertake the research work. They will have

to be trained and educated there, and to my mind the logical thing to do is to give all these universities, no matter where they are situated, an opportunity to carry out scientific work to the fullest possible degree. Then at Ottawa there should be established a central organization to do such work as the industries of Canada may be desirous of having done, either by a direct grant from the federal government or with the assistance of Canadian industry, much on the principle followed in the bureau of standards and the Mellon institute in the United States. I think it important that we should get out to the public the idea that we are going to utilize all the facilities at present available and then create additional facilities which may not now be in existence for these purposes. Having put it on that basis I think it will appeal to the good sense of every business man in Canada, and so far as the overlapping of work is concerned, I think that can be very well avoided. We have many problems in connection with our natural resources that are awaiting, and have awaited for some considerable time, investigations that will occupy all the time needed, and take all the money and all the men that we can provide for this purpose. Other problems and other fields that are not so important to us may be undertaken by other parts of the empire.

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February 13, 1928