Mr. MICHAUD:

I notice that the Minister of Public Works has been very modest in preparing his public works estimates in relation to the item of $2,500 for Campbellton. Possibly the minister does not know the town, but it is no small one; it is indeed a large town and besides it is a big shipping point in the maritimes. As a matter of fact last summer I believe more than forty-one ships loaded and cleared from that port with lumber for export. I understand that very strong representations have been made to the department regarding necessary material improvements at the port of Campbellton, because it is the home of one of the largest industries of the maritimes, a subsidiary or branch of the Fraser Pulp company, called Restigouclie Pulp. It is also a shipping point for lumber for not only the northern part of New Brunswick, but also a considerable part of Quebec in the Matapedia valley. It is admitted that for some years repairs have been greatly needed and demanded. The public wharf is absolutely out of order and I am informed by engineers that the paltry sum of $2,500 will be sufficient only to keep together what is left there. I understand the board of trade and all those interested are asking for a larger amount in order to put

that port into proper condition. If their demands are heeded and their plans carried out, I am informed that the estimated cost is between $30,000 and $35,000. Not only would this enable that port to be placed in a first class condition and encourage the traffic which is sadly needed in that part of the country, but it woidd indirectly relieve the unemployment situation in that district, not only through the employment of labour, and those lumbering towns are places where unemployment is prevalent in these days, but through the purchase of the timber required, which can be cut right on the spot, and the steelwork, which can be manufactured about a hundred feet from the wharf, where there are good steel works and where good friends of the government could provide what was needed. It is the government's own friends who are insisting that this work should proceed; all the material necessary for making the repairs can be secured locally.

This work would be in the interests of economy, because last summer difficulties were encountered on account of the bad state of those wharves and their inability to be used as they should have been. This summer there will be great need for the use of that port, because during the winter there has been an increasei in lumbering operations, and While this may not be known generally, 'Campbellton is to-day the centre of lumbering operations on a large scale in the maritimes. Outside Saint John, which is a national port, this is one of the local ports where a great deal of shipping is carried on for export overseas and to the United States. 'With the high rates of rail transportation the reason for these demands for repairs can be readily understood, because lumber exporters and manufacturers in that district cannot at present successfully compete with other exporters centrally located who have a short rail haul. I submit that the cost of not only ordinary repairs but material improvements at the wharf at Cambellton would be a wise expenditure. The unemployment situation in that district would be relieved by the provision of work early in the spring, and also by the manufacture right on the spot of the special dimension lumber that would be required as well as the work for the steel fabricated locally at Campbellton. I hope the minister will take not only my recommendation but the recommendations of the boards of trade and the captains of industry of that district who have made insistent demands for such repairs. Notwithstanding that it may appear as a demand on the treasury in times when economy and retrenchment

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are being preached, I repeat that it would be practical economy, because it is economy to spend money to preserve what is there and to make the facilities meet the needs of the case.

Hon. H. A. STEWART (Minister of Public Works):

The representations that have been made by my hon. friend in connection with this wharf are quite in keeping with those made by boards of trade and chambers of commerce in other directions. Unfortunately we have thought that the revenues at this time do not justify the expenditure, although perhaps the business there would justify it if conditions were better. This vote of $2,500 is just to make some repairs to facilitate ferry traffic, and does not in any way touch the larger question which my hon. friend has mentioned. Unemployment relief works, as my hon. friend knows, have been conducted in cooperation with the province and the municipality; these estimates are not framed for the purpose of unemployment relief, although of course any work carried on does help to relieve unemployment. I can only say that in connection with any program of public works that may be determined upon, my hon. friend's representations will be taken into consideration.

Mr. CASGRAIN:

This is a very large item. I would like to ask a few questions about it, and I think other members of the opposition will also wish to speak on it. One particular item that interests me is the item concerning the Baie Ste. Catherine wharf improvement, $10,200. I would like the minister to give the details of that work. It is under the heading of essential undertakings. Is it going to be given under contract, or not? I understood last year that the work was to be proceeded with, that an arrangement had been made with Price Brothers whereby

the government would get control of the wharf. Some minor or temporary repairs were made, but it never came to my knowledge that the government had purchased the wharf. Therefore I ask how the government can spend $10,200 on a wharf that is not public property. I do not object to works being done in my county, but I myself when I was on the government side, and also since I have been in the opposition, have tried many times to have the government come to a decision on the matter, but always the stumbling block apparently was that no arrangement had been arrived at or satisfactory conclusion come to with this company.

Mr. STEWART (Leeds):

My hon. friend is quite right; the transfer from Price Brothers has not been completed. As he knows, there is some complication in connection with their financial affairs. It is not proposed to spend this money until the transfer is complete. The money is required to repair the head block, which was damaged by ice in March, 1933, and was repaired temporarily in April, 1933. The only effective way to repair this structure is to straighten the outer end by widening the head block. The traffic involved is the ferry service for passengers and the royal mail.

Mr. CASGRAIN:

What repairs were made last year on that wharf? The repairs then made were supposed to be what was necessary under the circumstances; why is this big amount being asked for; especially for a wharf that is not as yet a public wharf?

Mr. STEWART (Leeds):

I have not the particulars, but my official tells me it was simply repairing the flooring of the wharf.

Mr. CASGRAIN:

Was there not a staircase or something additional next to the wharf to help the people embark or disembark?

Mr. STEWART (Leeds):

A movable slip.

Mr. CASGRAIN:

Was this work done under contract? If not, who was the supervisor, and who did the work?

M. STEWART (Leeds): I am sorry I cannot give my hon. friend the information, but I shall get it. The item will stand.

Sir EUGENE FISET:

Before we leave

this would the minister inform me if the repair work undertaken on the Rimouski wharf has been completed, and if it is intended to carry on further repairs on the wharf itself out of the general vote?

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Mir. STEWART (Leeds):

That information also is not available, but it will be procured and given at the same time.

Mr. CASGRAIN:

Do I understand that

item 109 stands, the whole item?

Mr. STEWART (Leeds):

Yes.

Item stands.

Mr. GOLDING:

Mr. Chairman, I would like to ask the minister if he has taken into consideration my request in regard to the situation at Bayfield, Ontario. The pier and the dock there are in veTy bad shape, and two lives were almost lost last fall as a result of the condition. I am not asking the department to spend any money unnecessarily, but I would be grateful if the minister would take that into consideration.