Mr. BROOKS:

Is the same compensation paid to the farmer in the case of reactors?

Mr. GARDINER:

The compensation in connection with every test is the same.

Mr. SENN:

There seems to be some conflict between two statements made by the minister with regard to tuberculosis. He made the statement that in restricted areas the number of cattle affected was one-half of one per cent.

Mr. GARDINER:

No. I gave certain information in connection with a group of counties in Ontario in which the number of diseased cattle had been reduced to that figure, but that was only after .restricted area regulations had been in effect for some considerable time.

Mr. SENN:

I understand that an unrestricted area becomes a restricted area just as soon as operations are commenced. I understood the minister to say that in accredited herds 12 per cent of the cattle would become reactors at some future time. Does that mean that the test is only 88 per cent perfect? To what degree does the minister consider these tests approach perfection?

Mr. GARDINER:

An accredited herd belonging to one farmer may be subject to contamination from herds round about, but when you have an area comprising several counties, an accredited herd in the middle of that area is much better protected. The proportion of reactors in accredited herds taken right across Canada is much higher than in the case of protected areas.

Mr. SENN:

Would the minister say that this test is 100 per cent perfect?

Mr. GARDINER:

I am not an authority on these matters, but those who are tell me that no test is 100 per cent perfect.

The CHAIRMAN:

Shall the item carry?

Mr. PERLEY (Qu'Appelle):

I think this

item should stand until the minister can give us the information requested. In the meantime we could go on with another item.

Mr. WALSH:

Are the inspectors appointed under the Meat and Canned Foods Act under the Civil Service Act?

Mr. GARDINER:

They are under the

Civil Service Act. I have the figures asked for by the hon. member for Dufferin-Simcoe (Mr. Rowe). The total for 1936-37 is estimated at 534 permanent employees while the total for 1935-36 was 492. In the case of temporaries, for 1936-37 the total is estimated at 188 and for 1935-36 it was 215. The temporary staff is down 27 while the permanent staff is up 42.

Mr. ROWE (Dufferin):

What is the reason for 'the increased number? What extra services are to be performed?

Mr. GARDINER:

One reason would be the matter which we have just been discussing, namely, the extension of the district in New Brunswick from a fraction of the province to the whole of it. This will require an extra service. The same thing will be true of the large district which is being added in Ontario. Additional abattoirs are coming under departmental inspection. These additional services require the employment of additional staff.

Mr. SENN:

I think the minister told us

that the amount set aside for indemnities was

Supply-Agriculture

$6,000 less than for the previous year. If additional officials are to be employed in connection with additional restricted areas, how does the minister propose to pay for the cattle which cannot pass the test?

Mr. GARDINER:

In answering my hon.

friend, I think I can repeat the answer I gave, I believe it was to the hon. member for Weybum (Mr. Douglas). Our hope is that in connection with this matter we may be able to go much further than these estimates would indicate. If we can go only half way through the season we shall have to let part of these staffs go; if we can secure additional money to permit our going right through the season, we can carry these staffs right through the year. Of course this money would have to be voted in the supplementaries. We are making provision to carry these staffs, but if it is found impossible to do the work, then naturally we shall have to cut down on it.

Mr. SENN:

In former years the amount

voted for this particular matter has been absorbed before the end of the fiscal year and proceedings have had to stop, and in some instances farmers who had cattle slaughtered were not indemnified until the new vote was brought in. That was rather an injustice which the minister should take into consideration.

Mr. ROBICHAUD:

Do I understand that where an animal has reacted but the carcass has not been condemned, the owner is allowed to sell the carcass for what he can get and is given full compensation in addition?

Mr. GARDINER:

I did not quite hear the question, but I believe the hon. gentleman wishes to know what happens in connection with compensation, and how much an owner is able to get if the animal is slaughtered. Compensation is paid and the owner is allowed to dispose of the animal at the abattoir for whatever it will bring; but it is disposed of under the supervision of our officials, the department being thereby assured that in connection with the matter nothing is done that may result in the owner obtaining money to which he is not entitled.

Mr. RYAN:

What work is being done by

the temporary employees?