Mr. MACDONNELL (Muskoka-Ontario):
These things are going to be settled some time. No sensible person believes that we are going to move through these next few years without heart-searching problems which will require the greatest unity that we can muster up. Not all the pleasant words in the speech from the throne conceal from the ministers themselves the tremendous problems they are facing. I quote Mr. Macdonald because he is a former colleague of the members of the government. He has asked- again and again why we cannot have that spirit. I do not know why. I say that sometime it will be done because we must have all people of good will and understanding in this country mobilized together if we are to arrive at what I suppose we should like to call our manifest destiny. I will say that if the Prime Minister will not do it, then there is another man in this house, my leader who sits here and who knows both sides of this question perhaps as no other man does in this country, who will do it when the time comes.
Mr. Speaker, I should like to add just a word or two briefly on the subject of -prison reform. I hesitate to make two speeches in one but this is my only chance, and perhaps I should make a small personal confession. I have a sort of pious interest in this because my father was chairman of a prison commission which reported some thirty-five years ago, and so far as I know the report which that commission made, while it was on a less ambitious scale than the succeeding reports, recommended things which were later recommended in the Biggar-Nickle-Draper report and more recently in the Archambault report.
I should like to read one sentence from the Biggar-Nickle-Draper report. The reason I read it is that-it is pleasant to speak on noncontroversial and non-partisan matters-I believe if bon. members would just take five minutes to consider what this sentence says we would not have fifteen months' delay in doing anything about the matter. We would not go on month after month neglecting it, leaving it while young men who -perhaps have made a slip and get into gaol are turned into adept criminals by associating with adept criminals. We would get on with it. I
should like to read this sentence which shocked me and I hope it will shock everyone in the house. It is very short:
Speaking for themselves, the members of the committee would not before undertaking this investigation have believed that the penitentiary system could have been as needlessly cruel as it in fact is . . .
Subtopic: CONTINUATION OF DEBATE ON ADDRESS IN REPLY