May 11, 1948

LIB

Édouard-Gabriel Rinfret

Liberal

Mr. RINFRET:

Then I move:

That bill No. 151, an act to incorporate the National Insurance Company, be restored on the order paper among private bills under the heading "House in committee," to be considered from eight to nine o'clock p.m. on Tuesdays and Fridays during the present session.

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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CCF

Stanley Howard Knowles (Whip of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation)

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. KNOWLES:

I rise to a point of order. I have no objection to the motion being moved, and no objection to the house agreeing to the motion if it wishes to do so; but it does seem to me that it requires forty-eight hours' notice. Standing order 45 provides:

Forty-eight hours' notice shall be given of a motion for leave to present a bill, resolution or address, for the appointment of any committee, or for placing a question on the order paper, but this rule shall not apply to bills after their introduction, or to private bills, or to the times of meeting or adjournment of the house. Such notice shall be laid on the table before six o'clock, p.m., and be printed in the Votes and Proceedings of that day.

The only phrase in that order which might be claimed by the hon. member as an exemption is the reference to notice not being required for private bills. The reason notice is not required for the introduction of private bills is obvious; private bills are presented to parliament by petition, but that is all that exemption covers. I go further and quote citation 357 of Beauchesne, second edition:

As a general rule every motion proposed in the house requires notice unless it is of a formal or uneontentious character, or raises a question of privilege.

Further I quote citation 321 from Beauchesne, third edition:

In the absence of standing orders to the contrary, the following motions may be made without notice:

I will not take the time of the house to read the kinds of motions that may be made without notice, listed under citation 321, but they do not include a motion such as this for placing something back on the order paper. As I have said already, I have no objection to the motion being made; in fact I think the house might grant the hon. member this concession. But my point of order is that if the hon. member is seeking by this means to reinstate something on which the house has already ruled, even if in committee of the whole, that makes it a contentious matter. If on the other hand he is prepared to assure the house that he is not seeking to reinstate the name of the company which was rejected by the committee, then it would be uncontentious and I should be willing to waive the requirement of notice.

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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LIB

James Horace King (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

I would call the attention of hon. members to standing order 45 as it appears in Beauchesne, second edition:

Forty-eight hours' notice shall be given of a motion for leave to present a bill, resolution or address, for the appointment of any committee, or for placing a question on the order paper...

I draw the attention of the hon. member to the following words:

. . . but this rule shall not apply to bills after their introduction, or to private bills . . .

The bill to which the hon. member for Outremont (Mr. Rinfret) is referring is a private bill; therefore according to standing order 45 it is not necessary that notice be given.

Is it the pleasure of the house to adopt tile motion?

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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?

Some hon. MEMBERS:

No.

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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PC

Harry Rutherford Jackman

Progressive Conservative

Mr. JACKMAN:

Knowing nothing whatever about the rules of the house, Mr. Speaker, I must appeal to j'ou in these matters. If this bill is to be restored to the order paper I should like to know whether the question of the name of the company, "National Insurance Company", again will be subject to the decision of the committee of the whole. May I ask your ruling on that?

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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LIB

James Horace King (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

I would say to the hon. member that I have no ruling to give on what is going to happen in committee.

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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PC

Harry Rutherford Jackman

Progressive Conservative

Mr. JACKMAN:

But this has to do with what has happened in committee.

Mr. SPEAIxER: I understand that the

motion of the hon. member for Outremont is to reinstate this bill under the heading "House in committee," and of course the Speaker ignores what is going to happen in committee. The hon. member knows quite well that if the bill is inscribed on the order paper to be considered in committee, then it would be the privilege of hon. members to discuss the bill in committee of the whole.

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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PC

Harry Rutherford Jackman

Progressive Conservative

Mr. JACKMAN:

As I understand the

matter, there was a private bill before the committee of the whole house on Friday evening, and when the first section was voted upon it was voted down. Then an attempt was made to go on with the second section; but inasmuch as that section-

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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LIB

James Horace King (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

Order.

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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PC

Harry Rutherford Jackman

Progressive Conservative

Mr. JACKMAN:

I am speaking to a point of order.

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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LIB

James Horace King (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

Hon. members will realize that there is a motion before the Chair. The Speaker and the house are supposed to ignore

Topic:   BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
Subtopic:   MOTION TO RESTORE TO ORDER PAPER A BILL CONSIDERED IN COMMITTEE AND NOT REPORTED
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194S


Business oj the House what has happened in committee until it is reported to the house. In this case it has not been reported to the house, so I could not permit any debate on what may have happened in committee. It is up to the house to accept or reject the motion which has been moved.


PC

Harry Rutherford Jackman

Progressive Conservative

Mr. JACKMAN:

I am not debating any matter that arose in committee of the whole last Friday evening. It did seem to me, however, in view of what took place there, that the whole bill died a natural death, perhaps for want of anyone knowing exactly how it could be kept alive. My contention is that at the moment there is no such bill as that which the hon. member wishes reinstated on the order paper, and that if he wants to have this matter introduced into the house again he must start from the beginning.

Topic:   194S
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LIB

James Horace King (Speaker of the Senate)

Liberal

Mr. SPEAKER:

I took the liberty of interrupting the hon. member for Outremont, who was discussing what had happened in the committee, because that is supposed to be ignored by the house. I thought he ought to move his motion, since the order for motions had been called, and I asked the hon. gentleman to do so. Now that his motion is before the house it is his privilege to explain it.

Topic:   194S
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LIB

Édouard-Gabriel Rinfret

Liberal

Mr. RINFRET:

As I was saying, Mr. Speaker, in committee I asked that section 2 stand. There was no decision on that point.

Topic:   194S
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CCF

Major James William Coldwell

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. COLDWELL:

Before the hon. gentleman proceeds, Mr. Speaker, I hope you will not consider that he is closing the debate. As I understand it, you are now giving him the privilege of explaining the motion.

Topic:   194S
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LIB

Édouard-Gabriel Rinfret

Liberal

Mr. RINFRET:

On my suggestion that section 2 should stand, no decision was reached by the committee. After that I made a second suggestion. I asked that the whole bill should stand, and on this motion there was no decision taken. I then asked that the committee should report progress; and at that very moment I saw that the chairman-

Topic:   194S
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?

Some hon. MEMBERS:

Order.

Topic:   194S
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May 11, 1948