May 11, 1951

PC
PC

George Randolph Pearkes

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Pearkes:

Can the minister tell us how many deputy ministers ithere are in this department and what are their salaries?

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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LIB

Brooke Claxton (Minister of National Defence)

Liberal

Mr. Claxton:

There is only one deputy

minister, and that is the deputy minister of national defence. His salary is $15,000. There are two associate deputy ministers at $10,000 each.

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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PC

George Randolph Pearkes

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Pearkes:

Is there any other officer

under this heading who is drawing a salary of $10,000? For instance, is there a controller of the inspection services? If so, what is his salary?

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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LIB
PC
LIB
PC

Edmund Davie Fulton

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Fulton:

Has the minister given the assistant deputy minister?

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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LIB
PC

Edmund Davie Fulton

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Fulton:

There are both assistants and associates, are there not?

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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LIB

Brooke Claxton (Minister of National Defence)

Liberal

Mr. Claxton:

There is one assistant who gets $8,000.

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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PC

George Randolph Pearkes

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Pearkes:

Having dealt with that, how many special advisers has the minister?

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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LIB

Brooke Claxton (Minister of National Defence)

Liberal

Mr. Claxton:

None. I beg pardon, yes. Engineer Rear Admiral Stephens, on labour questions particularly. Engineer Rear Admiral Stephens is a retired naval officer and his salary is $10,000. But he receives that in lieu of a pension of something like $6,000 plus; therefore he works for about $3,500.

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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PC

George Randolph Pearkes

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Pearkes:

Would General Worthington be considered a special adviser?

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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LIB

Brooke Claxton (Minister of National Defence)

Liberal

Mr. Claxton:

No; he is now transferred to my colleague the Minister of National Health and Welfare, and his salary is similarly fixed at $10,000, but he has not the advantage of both his pension and his salary, so he likewise is doing his present full time service for a supplementary income of something in the neighbourhood of $3,500 or $4,000.

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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PC

George Randolph Pearkes

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Pearkes:

Since this item covers civil defence, would not his salary be included in this item?

Supply-National Defence

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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LIB

Brooke Claxton (Minister of National Defence)

Liberal

Mr. Claxlon:

Yes, that is right, and we will transfer to the Department of National Health and Welfare the money necessary to meet their expenses on civil defence which has been provided for in these items.

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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PC

George Harris Hees

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Hees:

The hon. member for Calgary East has just pointed out that for the last several years he has asked the minister each year if he would not the following year bring down his estimates in the same form as they were brought down I believe up to 1947, and in the same form as other departments see fit to bring them down here. I have been here only one year, but last year I heard the hon. member for Calgary East pose this question to the minister. I think there was some kind of assurance, vague though it may have been, that that would be done. It seems that nothing has been done in the meantime. I think many hon. members have expressed the opinion before that if this were done a great deal of discussion would not have been necessary tonight.

The hon. member for Calgary East has again asked the minister the direct question: will the minister next year see to it that his estimates are brought down in the same form as other departments, and in the same form as I believe the department brought down the estimates prior to 1947? He did not see fit to give an answer. I would be very interested to hear from the minister a direct answer to that question.

Topic:   EMILY RITA ROWLANDS SIMPSON
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LIB

Brooke Claxton (Minister of National Defence)

Liberal

Mr. Claxlon:

No, sir, I cannot give an answer because the form of the estimates is entirely a matter for the Department of Finance, and the form in which our estimates are presented is not the result of my machinations, I can assure the hon. member, but is the result of the work of the Department of Finance, the comptroller of the treasury and the Auditor General. They indicate to us the form in which our estimates should be put and we put them in the form in which they want them. Now, I have no doubt they will read the discussion in Hansard and will take account of the hon. gentleman's question.

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PC

May 11, 1951