June 25, 1951

PC

James MacKerras Macdonnell

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Macdonnell (Greenwood):

I understand that a feature of this arrangement is the acquisition of certain rolling stock and other equipment. Is there a figure at which that is valued? I understand it is diesel equipment. How will that fit in with the steam operation of the national line?

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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LIB

Lionel Chevrier (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. Chevrier:

It is also electrically operated. There are 144 pieces of equipment owned by the railway, one of them being a steam locomotive and six being electric locomotives. I have the statement broken down as between locomotives, passenger cars, freight cars and other cars.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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PC

James MacKerras Macdonnell

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Macdonnell (Greenwood):

Just the total.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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LIB

Lionel Chevrier (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. Chevrier:

The total is 144 pieces, including 7 locomotives, 39 passenger cars, 88 freight cars and 10 other cars.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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PC

James MacKerras Macdonnell

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Macdonnell (Greenwood):

I meant the total value of the equipment.

Canadian National Railways

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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LIB

Lionel Chevrier (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. Chevrier:

The estimated cost of the equipment at present day prices is $3,775,000, which, less depreciation, would amount to $650,000.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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PC

William Joseph Browne

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Browne (St. John's West):

Is this the line that runs from Quebec through Ste. Anne de Beaupre?

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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LIB

Lionel Chevrier (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. Chevrier:

It is.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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PC

William Joseph Browne

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Browne (St. John's West):

Is that line not in poor condition? Will the Canadian National have to rebuild the line and replace the rolling stock, or do they intend to use the rolling stock that is being acquired?

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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LIB

Lionel Chevrier (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. Chevrier:

The line is in fair condition. Some of the rolling stock will have to be replaced, and the Canadian National Railways estimate they will have to spend a substantial amount of money to improve it; not only the equipment but also the trackage. They have estimated that and charged depreciation and interest.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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PC

William Joseph Browne

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Browne (Si. John's West):

I asked that question because I travelled on that line last year and it seemed to me in bad condition. I really believe this would be a good investment for the Canadian National, however.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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LIB

Wilfrid Lacroix

Liberal

Mr. LaCroix:

Will all the privileges already possessed by the employees of the company so far as pensions are concerned be looked after by the C.N.R.?

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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LIB

Lionel Chevrier (Minister of Transport)

Liberal

Mr. Chevrier:

I should think their position would be better, though I am not familiar with the matter at the moment. When this line is integrated with the Canadian National I should think the employees of Quebec Railway, Light and Power would have the same privileges as the other employees of the Canadian National Railways.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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PC

James MacKerras Macdonnell

Progressive Conservative

Mr. Macdonnell (Greenwood):

It is unfortunate that we in this house have not had a chance to hear the officials of the railway; nevertheless the minister has made a very clear statement. One thing still bothers me. There must be some further consideration or we would not be getting for $750,000 equipment which cost $3 million plus a railway which would cost at least something like $1 million, with the railway station. There must be some other disadvantages. Far be it from me to complain because we are getting a good deal; but one would like to feel that he understands what he is doing, and at the moment I frankly confess to being puzzled. Unless this equipment is run down to the point where it has no value; or unless, as the hon. member for St. John's West has indicated, the railway has to be entirely rebuilt, there must be something else. I appreciate the fact that the over-all figure the minister has given from the competent

officials of the Canadian National indicates that they believe this is a profitable deal, and I go a long way toward accepting their view. But I would like to feel that I understand this deal before voting for it.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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?

Mr. Si. Laurenl@

I think the hon. member is overlooking one factor which I know exists; that is, the personal relations between the vendor company and the public. Because of the existence of the two railways, during the winter the service to the public was very unsatisfactory. There were difficulties in keeping the cars properly heated. They had to be at a very high temperature before being set out, and they got very cold before being coupled to the train operated by a steam locomotive. The service has been complained about, and for a long time there has been this effort to have the C.N.R. take it over and give a satisfactory service. The C.N.R. would not pay any more than it thought it could justify on economic grounds.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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Section agreed to. On section 2-Conveyance free of charges.


CCF

Stanley Howard Knowles (Whip of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation)

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. Knowles:

Where will the power come from? Is the C.N.R. buying the source of power as well, or will it purchase power from this company?

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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?

Mr. Si. Laureni@

An arrangement has been made, which I understand the C.N.R. look upon as very satisfactory, for the supply of electric power by the Quebec Power Company, which was the parent company here. At the time this sale was arranged, quite a long term contract was arranged for the supply of power for the operation of the railway in the hands of the C.N.R.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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CCF

Stanley Howard Knowles (Whip of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation)

Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (C.C.F.)

Mr. Knowles:

Then will this vendor company actually go out of business?

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
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?

Mr. Si. Laureni@

I am not in a position to give a positive answer. This was the company that operated the street car service in the city of Quebec. The street cars have been replaced by busses. I do not know whether that was done by another subsidiary, or whether the old street car company acquired the busses, but the street cars have been completely removed from the streets of Quebec and the public is now being served by busses.

Topic:   CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS
Subtopic:   ACQUISITION OF THE RAILWAY OF QUEBEC RAILWAY, LIGHT AND POWER COMPANY
Permalink

June 25, 1951