Mr. Abbott:

No. I said I would show it to the hon. member for Calgary East and I did.

There was a written opinion.

Mr. Abbott:

I said, at the time it was asked for,

I did not know whether it was proper for legal opinions from law officers of the crown to be produced in parliament. X discovered later that it was not; but my hon. friend said he would like to look at it himself. Knowing what a good lawyer he was, I had no objection to showing it to him, and I did give him a copy of the memorandum the other day .. .

Perhaps that was improper; I do not know. In any event, I did it.

So there was a written opinion. Perhaps it would be interesting to hear Mr. Abbott's rejection of the motion by the hon. member for Eglinton on this matter. I am reading from volume 1 of Hansard for 1948, at page 331 where Mr. Abbott is reported as follows:

The policy which the government announces is the government's policy and it must stand or fall by that policy. It takes its advice from the permanent civil servants and in some cases accepts that advice and in other cases rejects it, for reasons. The government itself must take the decision. But to suggest that permanent civil servants should be subject to questioning as to what advice they have given the government would, if followed, be completely destructive of our parliamentary system of responsible government. I know of no case in which any suggestion has been made before this one to which I am referring. It has never been made in the British House of Commons. To my knowledge it has never been made before here and I hope this is the last time it will be made.

I am still quoting from Mr. Abbott.

One of the strengths of any British parliamentary government is the permanent civil service which goes on from government to government. The government may change but the permanent civil service is always there, ready to advise and carry on the functions of government. If we are going to expose the permanent civil service to personal attack and innuendoes and call them to account for

advice they have given to their political superiors, I say that we shall not be able to get any sort of first-class men in our civil service.

Mr. Abbott:

It is practically cleaned up. I

think this will perhaps be as close to the final clean-up as possible. The Joy Oil claim has now been settled. There are sundry administrative expenses which have been incurred by the crown and the vote of $310,000 is required for the administrative expenses together with the Joy Oil settlement and to allow for any further minor payments that may come up during the current fiscal year, the year which will end in the next day or two.

I should like to know the reason for this $65,277 hangover. At that time it looked as though the $310,000 then being voted was to cover everything.

Hon. Douglas Abbott (Minister of Finance) :

The answer is in the negative. I would point out that the municipalities are creatures of the provincial government.

Then the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Drew) said this:

If I may direct a question to the Minister of Finance, will he examine the basis upon which municipal taxation is applied to provincial buildings, in view of the fact that the principle upon which that is done has no relation to their being creatures of the provincial government?

Mr. Abbott:

The Minister of Finance is always happy to examine anything.

I note that the federal examination has taken place some three years later. The new Minister of Finance, in his straightforward way, today has said that they would not consider the granting of aid under this act on the basis of the assessment of the municipalities. I would suggest to the minister that that is an unrealistic approach. They say there is some danger that municipalities will use some devices over which they have no control and, specifically, assess government buildings at a higher rate than others. I think that argument would have no weight whatsoever anywhere in this country. Surely the people governing municipalities are as sound as those who sit in this house and would not use devious means to achieve their own end. I suggest to the minister that

Municipal Grants Act approach should receive further consideration and, in line with what other members have suggested, the grants should be extended by doing away with the 2 per cent floor. It would appear at first blush that when the minister said the 4 per cent was to be reduced to 2 per cent the grants were to be doubled.