Sir HENRY DRAYTON:
There is no
mystery at all about these figures, they are perfectly plain. The answers, as I understand,-I did not hear them read-referred to subsidies. I absolutely stand by the whole of the totals set out in that report. They do not deal merely with subsidies. Subsidies are indeed a very small part of them. The subsidies to the Canadian Northern are shown, and I think correctly shown, at some $38,000,000. The lands which the ' railway got in connection with the Manitoba charter and subsequently are shown at the amount that the company received for them, some $34,000,000. The loans outstanding on investment are also correctly shown, and the guarantees given by the Government are also correctly shown. Subsidies are one thing, proceeds of land sold are another thing, loans on outstanding investment are another thing, and guarantees outstanding are something else, entirely different. The total is correct. It is exactly the same in connection with the Canadian Pacific. The Canadian Pacific, under the head of subsidies are shown_ to have received $104,000,000, but you will see from the side note on the report that that
amount includes the value of the railways which had been previously constructed by the Government, and which under the contract was turned over to the company. Those values were arrived at as nearly as we could. Then, again, you have the proceeds of the lands sold. These were lands actually sold at that time and as a result the total, as the hon. member has correctly stated, is $228,000,000. The Grand Trunk was built before subsidies were paid as they have been in later years. They got subsidies from different sources, but so far as this Government is concerned the Government made loans to them many years ago. On those loans they never collected interest and as far as the Grand Trunk is concerned it is fair to say that the Dominion aid to the Grand Trunk amounted to $15,000,000.
Subtopic: GRAND TRUNK RAILWAY SYSTEM.